Weber modification

Discussion in 'Engine/Drivetrain' started by rabbit.arrow, Sep 24, 2014.

  1. rabbit.arrow

    rabbit.arrow Member

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    At LCE they told me the smog legal kit bolt directly to intake...and they don't include an adapter...Redline seemed to back that up...

    Tech at LCE said, emssions requires NO carb spacer or adapter... in Cali, for the years listed for the smog legal kit...but like I said, when he told me that, I was suspicious...I've never heard of a Weber on a stock 22r intake...thats what everybody gets the Offy for, but I want to suspend disbelief until I get real proof, one why or the other...
     
  2. rabbit.arrow

    rabbit.arrow Member

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    Redline seems convinced that the smog legal kit bolts directly to the 22r intake! And that they are just redrilled standard Weber 32/36 w/ emissions tag...
     
  3. rabbit.arrow

    rabbit.arrow Member

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    And talked to LCE again and they are certain that the smog legal kit bolts directly to intake, and that this mod can be done...he's sending me pics of some gaskets...but thats not much, I wanted to see a smog legal carb on the 22r intake...but they don't have one in stock...

    Smog legal kit number 1030063, on this page there is a video of a de-smoged 22r install...that I suggested they might sell more kits if the made an install video that matched the product on that page...
     
    Last edited: Sep 25, 2014
  4. first80toyota

    first80toyota Addict

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  5. rabbit.arrow

    rabbit.arrow Member

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    I do see that...but LCE told me it was wrong, that if you look at the picture there is no filter or carb to intake manifold adapter, both of which are listed where you pointed out...also they don't even mention the stock air cleaner assembly to 32/36 adapter that IS included
     
    Last edited: Sep 25, 2014
  6. rabbit.arrow

    rabbit.arrow Member

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    And they stuck to their story today adding "we've been in business for almost 30 years and I've installed thousands of these carbs..."
     
  7. ace89

    ace89 Member

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    lce hasn't done me wrong yet. got lots of parts from them.. they are expensive sometimes but have what you need
     
  8. White Trash

    White Trash Toyotaholic

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    I thought of this thread the other day while out in the garage. I grabbed a stock 22r base gasket and a weber base gasket and overlayed them. There is a whooooooole lot more than 5 thousandths difference, it's closer to 180 thousandths or 3/16" per hole .
     
  9. rabbit.arrow

    rabbit.arrow Member

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    Word, they sent me some pics...and I saw that...asked if they would take some measurements...they never got back to me...
     
  10. rabbit.arrow

    rabbit.arrow Member

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    But it maybe doable...I don't think that the webers, in the smog legal kit, are elongated holes, as they said...at least they don't appear so in the pics...
     
  11. rabbit.arrow

    rabbit.arrow Member

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    Thanks White Trash, helpful as all ways!
     
  12. White Trash

    White Trash Toyotaholic

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    No problem, the 2 piece adapter isn't the best setup ever but it works and it puts the carb at the correct height for the factory linkage to line up with the new carb. Just grab the right weber and 2 piece adapter along with the factory air filter adapter and go, go gadget properly running truck. :D
     
  13. rabbit.arrow

    rabbit.arrow Member

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    Yeah, that's what I've been thinking. Didn't think about the carb height in respect to linkage...I was told by LCE (in the same state as me) that a carb adapter (and weber filter, which I knew) would be a giveaway that the truck wasn't stock, thus being less likely to pass the "visual". And that the stock air filter would be pretty high (with adapter), and there would be a few problems with that, 1st: more likely to notice that there is not a stock carb, 2nd: that the air cleaner assembly might not hide EGR block off plate as well...

    The other thing I have been considering lately is if, like I was told by Redline, heatsoak would be a problem without the aluminum adapter? I just want the truck to run and pass emissions with no problems...I wish I could get more info on the smog legal kits...w/out ordering one...and that people would not make wild claims they can't back up...just to sound knowledgeable...

    P.S. I love Inspector Gadget!
     
  14. White Trash

    White Trash Toyotaholic

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    The factory air filter housing will cover up the carb and egr block off easily. I can measure the height of factory and weber carbs tomorrow if you want. I need to take a pic of the base plate gaskets anyway. :D
     
  15. aseq

    aseq Member

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    "They look under the car, under the hood, at the fuel cap, and at the dash; They also test at idle and at 25mph or so."

    Sounds exactly like the CA inspection, except for maybe under the car, never saw them doing that. I am pretty sure that both in AZ and CA you would pass visual with a weber hidden away under the filter and an EGR present but blocked. Except when you go to the anal smog testing place. There is an AAA owned car repair place off of El Camino, Santa Clara (CA) that does smog tests I went to a few times, but they're both anal, require an appointment a week or more in advance and they try to make you bring in the car before noon, so no drive in and done in 20 minuites like every other place. Avoid them for smog testing, they suck in that department. Just a friendly advice. :) Oh yes they also try to sneak in a +/- $15 x points inspection, argh, i can do that myself.

    Sorry for the rant.
     
    Last edited: Oct 23, 2014
  16. MrDinkleman

    MrDinkleman Enthusiast

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    As CARB adds more rules, you will see more and more shops doing that. CARB has been coming down on aftermarket cats. You can only use CARB approved cats that have to have that E.O. number. That is why techs are now looking under cars; if you have a new looking cat, they are going to ask for the E.O. number.

    Another new test they have is the rev test. They punch your throttle in neutral and rev the motor. They are looking for how much black exhaust shoots out. It is a totally subjective, visual, bull**** test....

    And you're right; some techs/shops are anal about the visual inspections. Some just go down the row of visual tests clicking "Pass".

    I took my truck in a few weeks ago but it failed even though it passed the sniffer because it didn't have a working Check Engine light. I went back two times (so far) to prove to them that my carbureted 1988 never had a check engine light; I even took my gauge cluster to show them. But according to their outdated manual it is supposed to and they wouldn't back down. I called CARB and got a copy of a page from the latest manual that shows my truck doesn't have a check engine light. I hope they accept it...

    Sorry for the thread hijack and rant...
     
    Last edited: Oct 23, 2014
  17. aseq

    aseq Member

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    "As CARB adds more rules, you will see more and more shops doing that. CARB has been coming down on aftermarket cats. You can only use CARB approved cats that have to have that E.O. number. That is why techs are now looking under cars; if you have a new looking cat, they are going to ask for the E.O. number."

    Yeah I know about stricter CAT regulations. Luckily these things tend to last forever. You can always make it look older if necessary. ;-)

    "Another new test they have is the rev test. They punch your throttle in neutral and rev the motor. They are looking for how much black exhaust shoots out. It is a totally subjective, visual, bull**** test...."

    Yeah that sounds like such bullcrap. I understand if an engine consumes a lot of oil it should be fixed, however a normal smog test would find that out. No need for this dumb stuff.

    "And you're right; some techs/shops are anal about the visual inspections. Some just go down the row of visual tests clicking "Pass"."

    The place I go to now is pretty great, it's an easy no wait in and out within 15 minutes. The person did not do any of that smoke test or under car checks. Though maybe it was because that time, last September, I was having a 97 miata tested: Auto Smog Test Only - Cupertino, CA | Yelp

    "I took my truck in a few weeks ago but it failed even though it passed the sniffer because it didn't have a working Check Engine light. I went back two times (so far) to prove to them that my carbureted 1988 never had a check engine light; I even took my gauge cluster to show them. But according to their outdated manual it is supposed to and they wouldn't back down. I called CARB and got a copy of a page from the latest manual that shows my truck doesn't have a check engine light. I hope they accept it..."

    That sounds like the people have no damn clue about these things. As far as I know a carburated car (at least the toyota pickups) has no check engine light (never seen it) by virtue of it having no damn computer.

    I like to say the carburetor is a computer, an analogue one in this case. It mechanically computes the correct mixture of gas and air and a particular rpm, throttle opening etc. Pretty much failure proof.

    "Sorry for the thread hijack and rant..."

    Likewise ;-)
     
  18. rabbit.arrow

    rabbit.arrow Member

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    Don't worry about it guys (@MrDinkleman and @aseq), interesting stuff!

    @White Trash did you take those measurements? I've been trying to ignore the carb, for now, cuz emissions is comin' up in Dec...but now it doesn't want to idle even after warm up (AAP valve disconnected) even tho it would before (AAP still disconnected)... I mean, of course the AAP valve SHOULD be replaced. I'll try and hold out for the Weber by turning up the idle:looney: (I hate it...but its better then revving it at lights, or anytime you let off, to keep the engine running) ...but this may give me trouble passing emissions :silly:
     
  19. aseq

    aseq Member

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    I think that as long as the idle is within specs it should pass. Even if it is a little higher than normal, mine is around 900-950 right now, I think I even had it a bit above 1000 rpm for a while and it passed smog fine. These 22R just feel a bit more smotth with the idle a bit higher, also makes it easier to get in and out the garage ;-) or going slow in a traffic jam uphill on CA hwy 17.

    If it won't idle it would fail I expect.
     
  20. White Trash

    White Trash Toyotaholic

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    Sorry, forgot about the measurements. The weber base is 93x46.5mm. Stock 22r is 96.5x50mm.
     

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