So, as you may have determined, I'm building a street/strip truck (more like strip truck that I drive on the street). Here's what I'm looking at....

I've determined in my old age that really nice, really fast vehicles were not the result of accidental deals being struck and the parts bolted on(although that worked ok for my last 'yota). Rather, they are the result of planning and budgeting, and sticking to both no matter what.

I've planned and budgeted MOST of this build except for one very key item, the engine.

Here is what I KNOW:
1.) It will be based on a 22r (or re) block
2.) it will cost a fortune at the machine shop, regardless of choice
3.) it will be naturally aspirated, and run on pump gas (highest octane available, obviously)
4.) it will have a light flywheel, and I'd like for it to be capable of 7k rpm, or as close as possible
5.) I'm gonna drive it......daily. It HAS to be strong.

Here's what I don't know:
1.) extensively worked 22r head, or extensively worked 20r head
2.) stroker, stock stroke, or de-stroked


Depending on these 2 factors, since they deal directly with deck height, I can start gathering parts.

I'm thinking that since I'm going with the light flywheel, it will rev quicker and this means a really tight valve train to help guard against over revving (dual springs a MUST). This also means that a free flowing head and exhaust are necessary (obviously). My real question is this: what is the maximum known flow rate of each head, after having been extensively worked (fully ported, bowls reshaped, biggest valves that I can possibly fit in the chamber, etc)?

Anyone?

 

Why don't you just swap in a 2rz and turbo it!

 

as litneon said. you can also contact Lc engineering. I would tell you how much hp and tq i have with my engine build, its just im at a stand still with the motor as i havent had the time or the drive to get it running agian...

 

Well, because shops selling parts tend to get pissed when you call and basically ask them how to build their $1k head for half the money yourself, none of which $ they get.

I've seriously thought about. Several factors, including but not limited to: availability of part, very short down time for engine swaps (built R to Stock R) should anything go wrong (like a rod flopping around, hanging out of the block)

That's cool ,man. Your truck is my old truck's red brethren....Whenever we get them finished, we'll have to line'em up!

 

considering my mild build on my 22R i still have plans to build an all out motor. seems like you are looking to do this same type of build. here's what i had in mind and why.

bottom end; i want the lower rotating assembly fully balanced by speed shop, order or have the crank counterbalancers knife edged to lighten up the crank and keep the drag in the oil pan lessened..... not so much that the motor runs so rough but if properly balanced it should not run rough at all. this will free up some of that rpm you are looking for. i'd keep it at stock stroke possibly upgrade the rods to a forged i beam set or whatever comperably stronger rod's i could find to keep up with the higher power and rpm range im looking at....

i would also get the double row timing chain set as you will need the extra support to keep the motor from stretching out the chain. oil pump water pump and the timing chain set i'd likely go through LCE since they have a fairly nice combo.

moving up i'd find the best head for my range power and applied use im looking for........ LCE has a ncie variety of heads they make but their prices are a bit out there....... from what ive found engnbldr makes a decently comparable head and will port the head for a little extra to your specific needs and still keep it under the slightly larger price figure LCE wants for theirs. double valve springs, high end retainers, good seats, and the usual biggie s.s. valves will apply. i think people also say that there are places that will custom fit the seriously big chevy v8 valves but me personally, i think the valves they stuff into the heads as it is are large enough an porting should be the essential key to making the most of the larger valves.

now considering you said you wanna keep it pump gas, i'd stick with the 22R head style and keep the compression easy for pump gas. the higher compression you can gain with the 20R head would be nice but for me, we have some warm days down here in cali and we also have traffic so considering that i'd hate to be having any heating or fuel issues due to the higher compression.

cams....... you got allot of flavors to choose from but me, i'd likely go with one of LCE's cams since ive had good luck with them.... as far as how big of a cam...... im not sure. havent done the research to see what work best with what mod's and application ive listed so far.... i'd ask them for some help in that area.

induction wise....... i wouldnt do anything less than side drafts but thats just me.... i'd likely go with either 44 or larger size sides.

as for exhaust i'd likely look into lce's larger diamiter 4-1 header, catless exhaust leading to a 2 1/2" exhaust piping.

and thats pretty much just the mentionable bigger details........ im sure there's more to be done for a 22R than what ive rambled on about thus far....... i dont claim to know everything about these motors or anything like that but this is what i have in mind as far as building a good top notch 22R so far

 

LC techs will be more happy to gave you the advice you need!'
These guys are very knowable & helpful!

 

Are you set to your decision on builfing up a 22r? Or were you interested in other engine options like a v6, v8, or L6? also are you going with manual or auto trans? The best bang for the buck right now is the 1UZ V8 motor that originally came stock in the Lexus IS300 - IS400. All aluminum block so its light, and you get about 250hp right out of the box. and the engine complete is only 650.

 

sounds good! also forgot to mention Engine builder i have been talking to them for about a week off and on about the motor for my 22rte and they are very helpful and at a decent price too. i plan on using them to redo my head and port matching and im buying there complete engine rebuild kit too.

 

I'm sure everybody has opinions but you should obviously only listen to people who have built and run there motors themselves, listening to billy bob that knows some guy thats freinds with the other guy, and people that do fantasy lc builds will get you a blown up motor.

Calling parts companies will get you a big bill and they will never give you all of the secrets, although buying a complete motor from companies that offer a dyno chart and a warrenty would be the easiest way, but for the garage do it yourselfer guys like sd and shonuff would be your best bet.

The only thing that I can offer is my personal build asfar as parts and build, I built my motor myself less the machine work.

My head has the large stainless valves and seats from lc, bronze guides and viton seals from engnbldr, dual valve springs from blaze speed, ad was milled to the max and ported in and out and port mached to the intake and header, it has an isky cam 465 grind, a standard timing chain with a lc cam gear and steel guides.

My bottom end is rather simple, the crank was knife edged, the block was bored to 94mm to accept the 10.5 forged wisco pistons, the factory rods and crank are forged on all laser block engines so I had the entire rotating assy balenced from the crank pully to the pressure plate. I have a crawler flywheel and centerforce 1 clutch.

I had a 500 cfm holly on it for a while but later traded down to a 38mm outlaw weber and noticed a large loss of power but greater gas mileage.

The ignition is all msd coil, box, wires, and e3 plugs and I indexed them.

The exhaust is a downey header, and downey muffler, its a galvi borla, and 2.5 tubing no cat.

The motor ran incredable prior to putting all the smog equipment back on, I did have the plesure of running a pair of 40mm sidedfrafts and it screamed.
With the sidedrafts I ran 175 rear wheel but I am positive it would be way higher with a aluminum flywheel. The machine shop that did the bottom end was F&F in North Hollywood and the Head was done by Baker Cylinder Heads in Henderson NV. he is my uncle, I hope you can at least get something out of this.

 

Thanks for the replies, fellas. Please keep the input coming!

The last 22r I built was a stock bottom end laser block. Stock crank, stock rods, stock pistons with plasma moly rings. New bearings throughout. The top end consisted of Engnblder stainless valves, springs, guides, seals, locks and retainers, and the 268 cam. intake was stock with a "modified" stock carb (a mechanic friend of mine tweaked it a little, not exactly sure what he did, but it was runner for sure!). Exhaust was a NWOR tri-y header, no cat, 2.25" pipe straight out the ass, no muffler ( I <3 Ky!). Ignition was a MSD 6al, blaster 2 coil, accel wires, and ngk plugs one heat range colder, and a NWOR ingnition recurve "kit" (it was a damn 15 dollar spring!). Stock flywheel, stock 4 speed, stock rearend. Oh, and a dry shot of nitrous. No jet, just a feed line mounted where the center stud used to be in the air box lid.

The truck ran alright. Power came on pretty hard at ~1800, and pulled kinda hard to about 5k or 5200. It felt most powerful right between 2700 and 3400, though. Which was fine.

This time around, I'm looking for power from about 2k and up as far as I can get. If my theory is right, then an engine making power starting ~2k, with a light flywheel, light wheels (like summit stars, or similar), aluminum drive shaft (there's a shop up the street that can make one any way you want it for a decent price), and set of rear gears ~3.27, 3.42, 3.55....should make for a decent 5th gear cruiser to and from work, but a real bruiser in 1st through 4th gear. It will see most of it's driving time cruising in 5th from 55mph to 80mph (10 miles @55mph to work and back, 65@70-80mph on the interstate to the family's place and back). However, I plan on taking it to test and tune nights at the local drag strip, they have street brackets on those nights.

I'm can't seem to choose between heads. High compression 22r, or REALLY high comp 20r.....decisions, decisions....

 

The build SD YOTA mentioned is almost exactly what I have. 22r block/head, no knife edged crank, but ARP mains, rod bolts, and head studs, dual chain with adjustable gear, LC head w/cam, big LC header, 2.5" exhaust, sidedrafts, MSD 6al + Blaster SS coil, 9lb flywheel. I'm not even looking to race, I just want a motor that's responsive and willing to rev.

I live about 5 minutes away from a drag strip and have another car that I race on a monthly basis (my truck is the support vehicle). There are a lot of guys I know with Toyota pickups that race, though, and I see them run a lot since I'm there all the time. The fastest 22r truck belongs to a Toyota tech and is pretty much LC everything, direct port nitrous, and slicks. It runs pretty deep in the 12's. There's all kinds of other variety including:

supercharged 22r: 14's
nitrous 22r: 13's
supercharged 4.0 v6: 13's (x-runner)
supercharged 3.4 v6: 12's (in a 86 2wd)
turbo 2rz: 12's
3.4 v6 with nitrous: 11's
sb chevy: 11's
etc.

So maybe now you understand why I don't want to race my truck.

 

You can also shave a few lbs. of rotating mass and add traction but installing a spool.

 

Nah, no spool here. I actually enjoy having tires, and the roads here are far to twisty for that to happen with a spool.

Shaving weight....putting her on a diet is definitely going to happen. I think I'll start with all the vacuum lines and egr stuff...

 

if you stroke your 22r i think it may be harder to get a 7k rev out of it. dont get me wrong it will go up to 7k. but a lil slower. and idk if de-stroke is possible. also because its over 6k floating valves is an issue and i forget if a 22r is an interference engine or not but dual valve springs can prevent floating but it may cause pre-mature cam lobe wear and could stretch valve stems. if anything swap a 20r or 18rg (you have a better chance of finding a unicorn then a 18r tho. lol)

 

20 and 22r have the same stroke. one just has a bigger bore.

 

a shorter stroke seems to be stronger as demonstrated between the 2rz and 3rz. The 3rz rods seems to be weaker since they are longer.

 

Well, I would need to find a machine shop that could offset grind the rod journals more toward the center line of the crank, then get longer rods or taller pistons in order to de-stroke it.Even then it wouldn't be by much (2.2L or so?)

I don't know about it yet, I might build a torque monster(for a 2Xr) and throw a real light fly wheel on it, then gear it all to hell...

Let me simmer on it a few days, then get some opinions.

Be expecting some pics soon, I got a couple parts in the mail yesterday, and I got a itchy trigger finger....time to warm the camera back up!

 

Also, does anyone else on here have any type of desktop dyno software? I've got Desktop Dyno '03, I've been building some 2Xr engines with specs from parts actually available. Would it be interesting to post some specs and "dyno" sheets? Or, would anyone want an "engine" built to get in the ball park of what your torque curve might look like? I'd be willing to do either of these if it'll help anything.

 

LC Engineering just sent me a confirmation email....

More tid bits should be here shortly.....